My dd12 is working this week as an assistant in a two year old camp run by an adult. Her friend has the job for the summer but asked her if she could stand in for her when she’s away, so she agreed. She likes working with kids – is great with her siblings and kids that she babysits for, and had a great time as an assistant at a camp for 6 year old girls a couple of years ago. Dd told me yesterday she hopes the woman doesn’t want her to continue, because she’s not enjoying the job at all, but knowing my dd (who is not only really good with kids but conscientious and a hard worker), I told her that was unlikely to happen. And anyways, I told her, it would be a terrible feeling to do a job so badly that someone felt the need to tell you that. I was right, since today she came home and told me the woman offered her a regular job for every day next year, in addition to wanting her to continue for the rest of the summer. Smart woman. But dd has adamantly told me she’s not continuing. And she already has another job offer (being a mother’s helper, basically) with someone else who will also teach her in shaitel construction/repair.
So what is it she doesn’t like about it, if she enjoys working with kids? She finds it boring and feels unproductive. She told me she thinks it’s very sad, to see two year olds crying for their parents and the parents pushing them to go in, instead of responding to them. Every day this week she has spent hours holding a child (different each day) who doesn’t want to be there and is crying for their parent. I don’t know what it is about her, but kids get attached to her very quickly and then refuse to go to anyone else. The first day, she spent all of her time holding a crying toddler, and when the older sister came to pick her up, the little girl didn’t want to leave my dd!
Some parents work and have no choice but to put their child in a camp or playgroup (this one is well run by a very responsible and caring woman). But many mothers are at home and really believe that their child needs to be in a group setting so that they can get that elusive ‘socialization’. I don’t know why people believe that children magically learn good social skills from being around other same age children who have never learned the prerequisite skills, either. We live in an age when children are seriously unparented and we keep justifying how wonderful that is by saying they’ll do better being around their peers all day. Why don’t we just look at the evidence in front of us, and see what has happened to a generation with parents who have very much faded into the background of their lives, from the time they are infants and through adulthood? Is our society a more loving and kind place? Are people happier? More emotionally stable?
I met someone in the store a couple of days ago who told me that an educator she very much respects told her that young children need to be in school to have negative experiences, since that is part of life. According to this argument, if they spend more time with loving and caring adults who actually guide them in learning new skills, they’ll be unprepared to effectively live in the adult world. I always find it ironic when people can’t defend sending children to school for positive reasons, all of a sudden the negative aspects turn into virtues. Saying something like this is a defense for school more than an intelligently determined position, which becomes quickly evident in even a short conversation.
I have to seriously challenge the presumption that kids best learn how to deal with unpleasant situations by being left on their own to figure it out. It’s like saying the best way to swim is by throwing a person into the deep end of the pool. Most parents wouldn’t teach their child to swim like that but I find to be very common for parents to support their choice to send to school by making the above argument.
My first question to a person saying this would be to ask, how does being in a bad situation benefit a child? To which they say that kids have to learn to deal with unpleasant situations to be prepared for life. My next question is, what does a child learn from being in that situation? (They unquestionably are learning something, but is that the positive lesson you want them to learn?) And how is the child going to learn when they don’t have any experience to deal with what they’re encountering? Yes, they can figure something out, but the likelihood that their response will consistenly be the healthy one is unlikely.
Wouldn’t children benefit from having a caring adult to help them navigate these challenging social situations? Adults who have had life experience in dealing with lots of things, who can actively guide them and help them develop healthy responses to the challenges? Remember, this argument about preparing kids for the harsh realities of life is made about very young kids through teenagers.
How much social maturity can you expect of a two year old, or five year old? Or even a fifteen year old (assuming he’s been in a peer dominated environment all his life)? In my experience, not much. And I think it’s cruel to purposely put children in a situation that they don’t have the skills to cope with and expect them to figure it out on their own.
Avivah
So true. Our society is just not comfortable with how much parental attention children need to thrive. I say this as someone who has to work to support my family. I can really see how the children benefit when I’m more available to them.
This past month, I’ve been between jobs and have therefore been spending more time with my children. DS7’s behavior has vastly improved, as has our relationship. Although I am thankful to have found a job, B”H, for the fall, I am sad that our time together will be more limited.
Parents get so many signals that anyone can do what they do — or better; that what they offer is not really so valuable. I wish there were some way to convince them that time spent together is an investment in the future of their children and their family, and well worth making some sacrifices to attain.
I actually was taught to swim by being thorwn in the pool, crazy right?
I come from an entire line of family who constantly vocalize their reasons why keeping my three and a half year-old son home with me is going to negatively affect him. My 85 year-old grandfather told me this week that my son is going to be ahead of all the children his age socially and academically because he is so used to being around adults (all family members). He meant this is a negative way and told me so. I replied that I never thought being “advanced” as he put it was a bad thing. He assured me that kids will pick on him and I said that if a kid is going to pick on him, that will happen regardless of being at home or homeschooled.
I am tired of hearing from every person that I meet that I am doing my children harm by keeping them home with me. I am tired of hearing that it is good for two and three year-olds to separate from their mommies, as if the crying will make them stronger and help them grow up. I find myself constantly telling people, often extended family, that a three year-old is not suppossed to be growing up, they should be a child and that childhood is the only time in their life in which it is ok to be a child, that for the majority of their life they will have to be an adult. i also remind people that my children will always be my children, but they will not always be actual children and I am already seeing just how fast the time is flying.
Yep. Hold on to your kids. Hug them close. Let their roots go deep. I, too, do not understand this near-obsession with getting kids out of the house as soon as possible. I think it’s very sad. 🙁
Ok, so Aviva, I used to agree with you completely, and now only partially agree with you.
I agree kids need their parents, and forcing them to get used to being without their parents “because they need socialization” is just wrong and silly.
Kids, in my opinion, do well around other kids and probably do better not just being in the company of adults, but not because they learn social skills from the other kids or anything of the sort. I would not send my son away to someone else daily, especially if he was crying when I left him, because I don’t want him to think that mommy abandons him.
However, I run a playgroup in my house daily, and I see just how much he gains from it. No, he doesnt learn to speak politely (though he is learning some hebrew words even though my playgroup is in english), doesnt learn from the kids how to share, play nicely etc. However, what he does get is to be in situations in which I, the adult, can teach him necessary skills to interact with the other kids (and in life), such as sharing, making up after a fight, etc. And he has someone who can run and do flips on the couch with him, someone who plays with animals with him, kids to give him attention.
For sure, if I were a different type of mom, perhaps I would be doing flips with him on the couch, would be building block towers with him, would create imaginary scenes with cars and trucks and animals with him, but I’ll admit it, I don’t always have the koach, and I have other things to do as well.
I notice how much better behaved he is when he has the entertainment of the other kids in the morning- on shabbosim and days off he gets so antsy that he’s a bit hard to deal with. I find my “vacation days” from playgroup to be more difficult than my non vacation days, that i consider my work days to be “vacation days” and visa versa.
I KNOW things are different when people have larger families and there are other siblings to interact with, play with, and fight with. But for now, my son is nearly two, I have a second on the way, but it’ll be a little while before he’ll have a sibling old enough to run and jump with him, etc. In the meantime, I see how much he’s gaining from being around other kids.
I think in a big family, especially one that homeschools, nothing needs to be done with the kids in terms of socialization, because they have their siblings. However, I think that the ideal for first kids in a family is lots of play dates in which mom comes to another mom’s house, the kids entertain each other and learn proper methods of interaction via parental instruction, and the kid doesn’t feel abandoned by mom.
Once the kid is comfortable around the other mom and wouldn’t mind her leaving, I see nothing wrong with leaving the kid with his friend and his mom for some time, with mom being on guard to come pick up her child should anything occur in which the child wants mommy.
My son used to be very attached to me, wouldnt leave me for more than a second- I couldn’t go to the bathroom alone even. Now, however, when we go to his “best friend”s house, he walks in and often tells me “Mommy go!” So I do sometimes, and don’t feel bad. He doesn’t cry, has fun with “Deeda”, and if he needs me, I’m just 2 buildings over.
When you live in an area in which all kids past 1.5 are shipped off to playgroup, either by necessity (mom working) or because the parents “believe in it”, it gets a little harder. But I believe there are ways to have your kid have interaction with other kids without them feeling like mom is abandoning them at the sitter or playgroup. You just have to think hard. My solution was to open my own playgroup.
Kids need their moms. They need to feel that they arent being dumped into the hands of strangers. But they also benefit from interactions with other kids.
Find a way to have them do both.
Where there’s a will, there’s a way.
“mamamoomoo” wrote:
>My son used to be very attached to me, wouldnt leave me for more than a second- I couldn’t go to the bathroom alone even. Now, however, when we go to his “best friend”s house, he walks in and often tells me “Mommy go!”
The second part of my post was lost for some reason:
It’s *because* he’s attached to you that he’s able to separate comfortably. Kids with insecure attachments are clingy. Kids with secure attachments are able to go out and explore the world, knowing that they can return to “home base” when needed. This takes different amounts of time for different kids and cannot be forced.
Mamamoomoo, I don’t think you disagree with me. But I do think you’re responding to a point I didn’t make – the idea that kids don’t benefit from interacting with other kids at all. There’s a big difference between a little of something and a lot. I don’t mind if my child has chocolate once in a while, but it would be very harmful for him to have it all day long, every day. Similarly, some time spent with friends here and there is nice; being left in a group setting every day for hours for the sake of nonexistent benefits is not.
It sounds to me within your playgroup (hosted by you in your home), you’re there to guide him – this is much more similar to a mother at home with her child than a child sent to a daycare; and there would be a loving adult in challenging situations to teach the child how to respond. That’s a critical factor to have in place.
It also sounds like what you’re saying the major benefit of having other kids around is it keeps him from being bored – which is why he’s not behaving so well when he’s alone with you. Playdates with friends with another mother around actively supervising are also good, since then she’s monitoring the situation. You’re allowed to not have the energy to entertain him around the clock, but if you were to suggest that being out of the house all day long was better because you’re too tired and it’s not reasonable to expect you to keep him happy, that would be problematic.
About your son not being clingy now – Jennifer is exactly right. Being ready to separate comes with time, not as a result of being in a group setting. My kids were very attached to me (which is how it should be) when young, and as they got older they felt increasingly secure and safe with the world around them and ventured further. They’re all very independent while still being emotionally close with dh and I. It’s the kids who have had separation forced on them prematurely who exhibit clinginess well past the age secure children have moved past it (or alternatively, excessive detachment) with their parents.
Oh right. I won’t disagree. What I meant about my son being clingy is that now I don’t feel bad leaving him by himself at someone else’s house, and if need be, i probably wouldn’t feel sooo terrible if he had to be in a daycare setting run by someone aside for me, because he isn’t so attached to me anymore. However, if a kid cries when mom leaves him, I too feel bad and would not leave them. I often told my husband about the kids that had a hard time adjusting to playgroup, that they probably would be better off if mom kept them at home longer, even if its harder on mom, because some kids just NEED mom at that age, whereas other kids have reached a more independent stage by then.
I think the dynamic for my son in my playgroup is similar to how it would be when i have a larger family, iy’h…
I am disagreeing on the last little bit though- I think that my son is benefiting from the long days with peers. Or maybe it is my sanity that is benefiting, because I don’t have nearly as much energy as my 22 month old has, especially in the heat and 8 months pregnant, so entertaining him all day with just a playdate for an hour or so every other day would just require too much energy from me right now, more than I’m capable of giving in my current circumstance.
Hi Mamamoomoo –
I have always had to work because we needed the extra money to put food on the table. At one point when some of my kids were small I worked in a daycare center because I was able to bring my kids with me. My kids were the only ones who didn’t need a security blanket why because I was there and I was their security blanket. Over the years I have really treasured the unbeleivable gift and privelage of raising Jewish Neshamas. Yes it is exhausting and trying at times but it is so unbeleivably worth it. The kids that I had to leave at a babysitter all day because my dh was learning in Kollel have issues that my other kids don’t have. When you give a child what they need when they are little the cost will be so much less later on.